Why different page theme? Makes no sense

Ian Shere
67 Posts
Ian Shere posted this 17 October 2015

Themler has overly complicated the Home/Pages/Blog thing. Why? Give me a valid reason that everyone would want. I can see the theory as to why it's been done, but all it achieves is a massive increase in the work to design a theme.

Partly, my frustration probably stems from the woefully inadequate documentation which is so basic in its content as to be practically useless. Why can I not apply the Home theme to every page? Why am I forced to create themes for different pages. Imagine if, by some crazy notion, a person wants the same theme on every page (of course this would never happen would it?).

I want to design a theme that is applied to every page regardless of what sort of page that is - like Artisteer did. Why am I forced to design a Home page theme, Blog page, page, post.... come on - where's the value in that?

I tried to follow some instructions about copying and pasting rows from one template to another - couldn't get it to work. If there's no easy fix for this, I'm going to have to look elsewhere. This is a major roadblock to me.

Themler has overly complicated the Home/Pages/Blog thing. Why? Give me a valid reason that everyone would want. I can see the theory as to why it's been done, but all it achieves is a massive increase in the work to design a theme. Partly, my frustration probably stems from the woefully inadequate documentation which is so basic in its content as to be practically useless. Why can I not apply the Home theme to every page? Why am I forced to create themes for different pages. Imagine if, by some crazy notion, a person wants the same theme on every page (of course this would never happen would it?). I want to design a theme that is applied to every page regardless of what sort of page that is - like Artisteer did. Why am I forced to design a Home page theme, Blog page, page, post.... come on - where's the value in that? I tried to follow some instructions about copying and pasting rows from one template to another - couldn't get it to work. If there's no easy fix for this, I'm going to have to look elsewhere. This is a major roadblock to me.
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adanku
35 Posts
adanku posted this 18 October 2015

I am wondering myself. An answer or explanation to this would be good. The documentation on this is very poor. I have read it over and over and still have issues with post pages.

I am wondering myself. An answer or explanation to this would be good. The documentation on this is very poor. I have read it over and over and still have issues with post pages.

Last edited 18 October 2015 by adanku

Marco
155 Posts
Marco posted this 18 October 2015

Ill give you some from my Practise:
For the HOMEPage I want to use a 100% width design. On my log/Post/Default Pages this would be look very shitty.
So On my HOMEPage I have no Modupositions, just 100% width, no breadcrumbs, etc.
On the other Pages I want to have.
Or I want 100% width on HOME AND! DEFAULT Page, but not for Blogs/Pages...
Understand?!
HOMEPAGE

enter image description here

DEFAULT Page
enter image description here

So, Do you understand? Sometimes the predefined templates are not enough. for example at one Webproject i have needed 4 new layouts for different pages, etc...

Hope, it´s bit clearer now.
regards

Ill give you some from my Practise: For the HOMEPage I want to use a 100% width design. On my log/Post/Default Pages this would be look very shitty. So On my HOMEPage I have no Modupositions, just 100% width, no breadcrumbs, etc. On the other Pages I want to have. Or I want 100% width on HOME AND! DEFAULT Page, but not for Blogs/Pages... Understand?! HOMEPAGE ![enter image description here][1] DEFAULT Page ![enter image description here][2] So, Do you understand? Sometimes the predefined templates are not enough. for example at one Webproject i have needed 4 new layouts for different pages, etc... Hope, it´s bit clearer now. regards [1]: http://imgs.url1y.com/uploads/1/23/0tfkbz9etb2pfrfa.png [2]: http://imgs.url1y.com/uploads/1/21/1f4069elnlwcxi3i.png
Ian Shere
67 Posts
Ian Shere posted this 18 October 2015

I see and that's a valid use. But every time on every design? Not every client wants a full width design on any page. Where pages are to be the same, Themler's way of doing things makes the workload so much greater. (You'll see that my question was "...that EVERYONE would want...")

A simple fix I see would be to make the selectors under the "Templates" tab in the Template Manager able to pick up ANY template style. Right now, only a style under "Home" can be used on the Home page, only one under "Blog" can be used on a Blog page. If you're talking advanced flexibility, this is NOT! Advanced flexibility wouldn't tie us down like this, but would give us the ability to mix and match as we choose.

Lastly, not all of us need multiple template styles per project. While your post is valid for some projects, a basic website can easily be accomplished with a single style and the use off full-width styling to some modules (if desired/needed). Why the need to produce a minimum of 3 template styles just to create a simple site (Home, Page and Blog)? The fix I talked about above will still let a designer go nuts in developing multiple styles if needed, but not hamstring them if a single style will suffice for the client's needs.

If Themler wants to keep this rigid way of style assignment, they need to add an easier way of copying Containers, Rows, Positions, etc from one style to another. Right now, with it's single Container or Row at a time is too slow and cumbersome. How about checkboxes by the elements and, as Joomla does with menu items and many other elements, a "Copy to.." or "Move to.." <style></style>

I see and that's a valid use. But every time on every design? Not every client wants a full width design on any page. Where pages are to be the same, Themler's way of doing things makes the workload so much greater. (You'll see that my question was "...that EVERYONE would want...") A simple fix I see would be to make the selectors under the "Templates" tab in the Template Manager able to pick up ANY template style. Right now, only a style under "Home" can be used on the Home page, only one under "Blog" can be used on a Blog page. If you're talking advanced flexibility, this is NOT! Advanced flexibility wouldn't tie us down like this, but would give us the ability to mix and match as we choose. Lastly, not all of us need multiple template styles per project. While your post is valid for some projects, a basic website can easily be accomplished with a single style and the use off full-width styling to some modules (if desired/needed). Why the need to produce a minimum of 3 template styles just to create a simple site (Home, Page and Blog)? The fix I talked about above will still let a designer go nuts in developing multiple styles if needed, but not hamstring them if a single style will suffice for the client's needs. If Themler wants to keep this rigid way of style assignment, they need to add an easier way of copying Containers, Rows, Positions, etc from one style to another. Right now, with it's single Container or Row at a time is too slow and cumbersome. How about checkboxes by the elements and, as Joomla does with menu items and many other elements, a "Copy to.." or "Move to.." &lt;style&gt;&lt;/style&gt;

Last edited 18 October 2015 by Ian Shere

Marco
155 Posts
Marco posted this 18 October 2015

I absolutely understand your way of thinking.
But please dont forget, that Themler is very different to sth like Artisteer which is for not so familar with HTML, CSS, etc. users...
All the Years many many ArtiUsers cried there should be an "advanced" tool with more flexibility.
Now you´ve got exactly this, and again the same - crying why not easier, etc...

Please understand me correct. I dont want to attack you. But i think themler has done a good job.
sure, it´s still a beta vor me. but i think themler is nearly perfect for advanced usage. More then artisteer.
If osmeone want an easier way - just use artisteer. My opinion.

Yes, they defenitely need to rethink some things, But the main-way is great.
I designed nearly 7 websites with themler now. All with Joomla. I never find some product like this which gives the flexibility to use deifferent layouts on different kinds of pages...

once again. i dont want attack you. But themler is a product for more advanced users. All the years the people want to have sth like this. Now you have it. Be happy and learn understanding the work with themler - then it goes like a charm and ultrafast for designing a great looking website...

best regards Marco

I absolutely understand your way of thinking. But please dont forget, that Themler is very different to sth like Artisteer which is for not so familar with HTML, CSS, etc. users... All the Years many many ArtiUsers cried there should be an "advanced" tool with more flexibility. Now you´ve got exactly this, and again the same - crying why not easier, etc... Please understand me correct. I dont want to attack you. But i think themler has done a good job. sure, it´s still a beta vor me. but i think themler is nearly perfect for advanced usage. More then artisteer. If osmeone want an easier way - just use artisteer. My opinion. Yes, they defenitely need to rethink some things, But the main-way is great. I designed nearly 7 websites with themler now. All with Joomla. I never find some product like this which gives the flexibility to use deifferent layouts on different kinds of pages... once again. i dont want attack you. But themler is a product for more advanced users. All the years the people want to have sth like this. Now you have it. Be happy and learn understanding the work with themler - then it goes like a charm and ultrafast for designing a great looking website... best regards Marco
Ian Shere
67 Posts
Ian Shere posted this 18 October 2015

I totally agree Marco and no offence taken. However, I believe that these are still valid criticisms/suggestions. I have been one wanting a more advanced tool, though I still use and love Artisteer. However. I'd prefer to just have one tool I use and not have to swap between them. Themler does everything Artisteer does so why continue on with it? I know that there's claims that Themler is not meant to replace Artisteer, but I believe that's just trying to placate all those who are going to be really annoyed when Artisteer lags waaaaay behind.

Themler is so far more advanced than Artisteer, but, in being advanced, don't cut yourself off at the knees by making poor interface choices. Again, as I mentioned in the last post, the ability to copy/move elements easily between styles should be implemented. Right now, it's just too cumbersome. It's like giving someone an assignment in Word to duplicate, but telling them they can only copy/paste one sentence at a time.

Cheers

I totally agree Marco and no offence taken. However, I believe that these are still valid criticisms/suggestions. I have been one wanting a more advanced tool, though I still use and love Artisteer. However. I'd prefer to just have one tool I use and not have to swap between them. Themler does everything Artisteer does so why continue on with it? I know that there's claims that Themler is not meant to replace Artisteer, but I believe that's just trying to placate all those who are going to be really annoyed when Artisteer lags waaaaay behind. Themler is so far more advanced than Artisteer, but, in being advanced, don't cut yourself off at the knees by making poor interface choices. Again, as I mentioned in the last post, the ability to copy/move elements easily between styles should be implemented. Right now, it's just too cumbersome. It's like giving someone an assignment in Word to duplicate, but telling them they can only copy/paste one sentence at a time. Cheers
stacey
3 Posts
stacey posted this 01 February 2016

This could be easily solved with a "Master" template setting, then you can have one design that covers all templates unless you choose to edit them separately, that way everyone is happy.

This could be easily solved with a "Master" template setting, then you can have one design that covers all templates unless you choose to edit them separately, that way everyone is happy.
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